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- cross-posted to:
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A patent application from the company spotted by Lowpass describes a system for displaying ads over any device connected over HDMI, a list that could include cable boxes, game consoles, DVD or Blu-ray players, PCs, or even other video streaming devices. Roku filed for the patent in August 2023 and it was published in November 2023, though it hasn’t yet been granted.
The technology described would detect whether content was paused in multiple ways—if the video being displayed is static, if there’s no audio being played, if a pause symbol is shown anywhere on screen, or if (on a TV with HDMI-CEC enabled) a pause signal has been received from some passthrough remote control. The system would analyze the paused image and use metadata “to identify one or more objects” in the video frame, transmit that identification information to a network, and receive and display a “relevant ad” over top of whatever the paused content is.
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tl;dr never buy anything Roku, ever again. Got it.
Roku has patented a way to ensure I don’t buy their junk.
Roku about to patent a way to make you buy their junk.
Just imagine they work out a deal with every consumer TV manufacturer to put this on everything.
I’ll just buy a giant monitor then, it’s better anyway.
If only they made 60"+ monitors, I’d do the same. But since those don’t really exist, the options are:
- prevent TV from accessing the Internet
- get a commercial grade monitor - more expensive
- projector - most seem to not have smart nonsense
- pihole - may or may not work
I’m going to try out the first, but allow certain accesses (Netflix and Disney+). If that works, I may not need to worry about the rest of the list.
Yeah… I’ve been evaluating moving to Plex or Jellyfin.
Kinda getting done with a lot of this smart stuff. The Monopolies are flexing and I don’t enjoy it.
Just do it. I ripped our DVDs and put them on my NAS with minidlna configured, and I can now stream my stuff directly to my TV through the “Photos and Videos” app. My other TV has a Raspberry Pi running Kodi, so if my next TV doesn’t support dlna, I’ll just do that.
Screw all of these companies and their predatory practices.
Jeff Geerling discusses having done the same, in one of his videos.
Fwiw, this was also on HN yesterday. Never tried it myself, though:
Do it, it’s great. The NVidia Shield is a great client for it but is getting more and more adds on the homescreen. The are alternative loaders without the add you can put on it.
You’ve got it the other way around. Roku sell their TVs at a loss. Buy one, use it as a dumb screen and help them go bankrupt faster.
Good way to kill their product…
I can’t imagine anyone that would leave the device plugged in after the first ad comes up. Pretty much anyone using such a device would also know how to unplug them. They clearly have other uses for that screen, so it’s not a total loss to keep it unplugged till the user can switch to a different brand.Ah it’s a Roku TV entirely. Reminds me of the Samsung TV ads
Roku TV sets come with ads. Generally, these are restricted to Roku’s home and menu screens, its screensavers, and its first-party video channels, and once you start playing video, the only ads you’ll see are the ones from the service you’re streaming from. That said, Roku TVs have shown ads atop live TV before.
Now, the company is apparently experimenting with ways to show ads over top of even more of the things you plug into your TV. A patent application from the company spotted by Lowpass describes a system for displaying ads […]
Sadly they already have all the money
So we just ordered a new tv and just want the universe to know that Roku wasn’t even considered and this shit is why.
I mean, yeah sure, but are the alternatives that much better in this respect? Which alternative non-ad-ridden, privacy-respecting smart tv would you recommend (or ended up buying)? Asking for my future tv choice…
Commercial displays are your best bet, although they can be quite expensive.
Will probably last longer too since they’re intended for 24/7 or at least 16/5 continuous runtime.
Samsung, but I’d rather report back when I see if it’s a mistake.
I intend to keep using my AppleTV and hope that’s the end of it. But the Samsung was a process of elimination of Roku and LG via shitty experience with the WebOS on the work TV. If Tizen doesn’t stay out of the way then I’ll start playing router games.
We have a HiSense Android TV (most are now Google TV, but they’re essentially the same). There are ads by default, but you can install a custom launcher with no ads, so the experience is much better.
I use Projectivity launcher and it looks nicer, has no ads, and it’s much faster and more responsive.
As soon as I figured out how to install a custom launcher, I researched how to disable ads similarly on our Roku TVs and discovered all of the secret menus that could have disabled them, except they no longer work.
So the Roku level of lockdown on their custom OS is much worse now versus an android-based OS.
While Google is hardly privacy-respecting and ad-free, I guess the fact it can be more easily customized is a plus, maybe I should consider it for the future. After all, that’s the same reason I stick with Android.
Can GoogleTV be rooted like android can, preferably without resorting to hacks, like in some android phones where the bootloader is unlockable?
Can GoogleTV be rooted like android can, preferably without resorting to hacks, like in some android phones where the bootloader is unlockable?
Not that I’ve found, although over at XDA forums they seem to be working on it. I unlock and root my Android phones, but I doubt any TV manufacturer has even considered making their bootloaders unlockable so it’s an uphill battle.
I’m glad they patented it so that any of the products I actually buy won’t be able to do this
Parents can be licensed for use by other companies.
Autocorrect or comment on society?
¿Por qué no los dos?
If it’s patented, it can also be hacked more easily.
Why?
I think they’re erroneously stating that there will be so much technical information in the patent that it will be trivial to reverse engineer and remove from Roku products.
Unfortunately that isn’t the case.
Ahh you’re right that’s probably what they meant, but yeah in that case every patented software would be hacked
Well, the idea is that anything and everything can be hacked. It’s just that the difficulty varies wildly; some being trivial whereas others are impossible until someone finds an exploit. If you’re working with a total black box, you’ll have to make many assumptions, which means that figuring stuff out may take a while. If there’s at least some documentation, such as a patent, you won’t have to guess absolutely everything. That doesn’t guarantee that it’s going to be easy. Maybe the patent doesn’t go into much technical detail, but still manages to describe the product in just enough legal detail that the company can sue anyone trying to come too close.
It will be licensed to manufacturers with advertising incentives and packaged into consumer electronics.
Savvy electronics users will supply their own HDMI cables; this product will be for people who only understand enough to plug the ends between their box and the entertainment system.
Hell, you might even see these cables being handed out for “free”, akin to the AOL disc days.
The amount of ewaste they will be producing when they push that update. Should be against some environmental laws.
Not what laws are for.
Is what guillotines are for.
Give me freedom from advertising or give me death.
Roku would gladly do the latter if they thought it profitable
Roku somehow thinking that the Ferengi rules of acquisition was a how-to guide book.
Bread and circuses. They’re gouging us on the bread and making the circuses inaccessible, these dipshits are practically begging for a red terror, by making the worst outcome still better than the ongoing white.
If I were making their decisions for them; I’m not sure I could do much better at priming the populace for revolution.
Can’t we put these devices in some kind of dev mode and install software to stop this shit?
I assume these devices run some kind of Linux kernel, with a stripped down Linux distro.
The problem there is proprietary hardware blobs, no one’s made open-source drivers for any of the myriad TV manufacturers, each with their own OS.
How do emby or jellyfin devs develop clients on roku?
I would think, if you have that level of access, you could also stop or patch whatever OS services they run.
Surely you can ssh into these devices right?
The API for developing apps is absolutely open, but the OS isn’t. They’d give you some kind of development environment (like Android with Android studio), and a way to get logs out. The apps are often vetted by the platform like Android and iOS apps are, and they’d be able to override anything your app could do anyway.
So think consoles, phones, tablets, etc. The OS is locked down, but you can develop apps for it.
So probably no SSH access unless you find a backdoor or something. Your time is better spent buying something without that crap, like certain projectors, commercial displays, etc. They subsidize the cost of the TVs with that nonsense, so they’re going to prevent you from removing it.
roku generally puts a lot of effort into security
“security” for themselves, not the customer, I guess
i’m trying to say that they’re pretty locked down
roku has patented a way to go fuck itself
Now, if only they would invent the exact opposite of this, I would buy it
I want zero ads. Ever.
They did! Its called a pihole plus ublock origin plus piracy.
You can’t buy it, only the hardware, but the software is all free.
Still doesnt block youtube ads 😩
For ad-free youtube on Android TV: SmartTube
For ad-free youtube on mobile Android devices: ReVanced
For desktop: Firefox + uBlock origin
Also for Android: NewPipe
Also for desktop: FreeTubeOr GrayJay for Android
Or Tubular
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Ad free YouTube on RokuOS? TIZEN?
Ad free YouTube on iOS?
Sadly, Firefox + ublock is becoming unreliable. I routinely can’t play YouTube videos on my desktop computer with that setup (+ a vpn) because google just won’t serve them. I just get perpetual loading screens.
Are you… Are you using the yt APP!?
Roku TV 😞
Oh. Oh no. Do you need a hug? A hammer?
So if you can side load check out smart tube app
Revanced only, bby!
You can’t defend against ads with pihole if the ads server has the same address as content server
This is true. Hence the piracy. Only way to go ad free.
But with the risk of malware infection, unfortunately.
When something is free, you’re the product.
I’d advise to continue to use non-pirated products, but only from those companies, whose service you’re satisfied with.
And if there’s none, don’t consume product at all. It’s not like movies are vital for you.Vlc is pretty good, and I run a pretty strange distro. If I’m extra scared, I’ll use qubes or get a sacrifice machine.
I think the poor having culture is important. Either art is important, or it Fucking isn’t. You seem to be arguing its the frivolity, not the substance and fruit of civilization.
Video isnt my favorite medium, I have a lot of criticisms of it, but its still art, still precious. And so everyone deserves to have it.
And so everyone deserves to have it.
And authors along with those, who maintain content distributing infrastructure, deserve to be rewarded for their labour.
But I can’t pay them. Its not generally an option. Have you seen the terms on their Fucking contracts?
Literally the closest I can get is wandering around Los Angeles giving money to people who look vaguely familiar or give off writerly vibes.
Have you heard about our new ad-blocking TVs?
Thanks to our patented Ad-Away technology, they’re guaranteed to keep you free from all ads! Get yours now, Ad-Away subscriptions start at $49 a month!2 years later, somewhere in their sales and marketing departments:
“Hey, you know what would make us even more money?”
“No, but do tell”
“Advertising”
“Genius - how is it nobody has ever thought of this before?”
Lol 😂
Nice 😆💀
I’ve just invented a way to never use a Roku product again, and I’ve chosen not to patent it.
The process is this:
- Don’t buy anything from Roku anymore.
Or anything with Roku embedded in it already.
On this episode of Black Mirror…
I’m tired boss…
My TV set is like a dumb monitor: HDMI in, colorful image out, basta.
Not even audio. And of course it does not get any internet connection. And I don’t feed it any caviar.
TIL what ‘basta’ means.
Enough, stop. TIL.
Lmao@the people who think you’re telling the person you replied to to stop
(Ngl was me before I looked it up)
😂
Sounds like a class action lawsuit waiting to happen.
Imagine that you pay for an ad free streaming service through your roku, like HBO for example. And now you have ads streaming over it?
People will sue for a way to disable it over ad free paid content.
Also, this will lead to way more pirating. People are sick of advertisements.That’ll be why they just pushed a “agree to our new license with arbitrage or your tv is a brick” update
People who don’t pirate already are fools.
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Let 'm pirate. Teach them how to do it better even.
Even if people sue, doesn’t mean they have any legal grounds to win. What law is Roku breaking? You can’t sue your TV manufacturer for not being 4k when you pay for 4k content. Your content display technology has the right to display content how they see fit.
I see this as a job for the free market. As consumers we need to show Roku how we feel about that.
If I purchase a TV, that I now own, and after I own it the company “updates” my TV that I now have to watch ads in order to use the TV I purchased without that condition?
At minimum it’s a breach of contract
Their recent ToS update: “We bricked your TV until you ‘consent’ to waiving your right to sue us if we do something illegal. Also, we won’t tell you what you’re consenting to up front, instead we’ll make you spend hours reading through pages and pages of legal garbage to find where we buried this statement.”
They know that nobody would agree to this if they put it in big bold letters right above the “agree” button, so they bury it behind hours of tedious reading so that people cave in and just “consent.”
If you roofy someone’s drink and pester them until they “consent” to sex, you would get thrown and jail and probably shanked in the liver. If Roku bricks the TV that you purchased and won’t let it work again until you consent to something that you’re nearly guaranteed to miss or not understand by design, their profits go up because people can’t sue them.
This capitalism hellhole can’t burn down fast enough.
The free free market requiring a cool hat and tropical bird.
The free market has failed dude. THIS IS THE RESULT of it!
Capitalism and our current implementation has many failings. A company making a really shitty anti-consumer decision when there are plenty of alternative competitors and options is not one of them.
Capitalism rewards the most ruthless pursuits of money. Without regulations monopolies, shit products, and the cheapest wages possible are the end results of it as those are the most efficient ways to get as much profit as possible. In the end, any company that doesnt participate in such tactics gets out competed
Capitalism, has a bunch of problems. Those are some of them. Frankly I think it’s due to collapse and I hope we’ll be better for it. But Roku? Monopoly? They’re a mediocre company making a possibility short sighted decision. This is capitalism working as intended. Don’t buy it if you don’t like it.
If you don’t like capitalism call out real problems, because this just sounds like you’ll take anything that looks bad and blame it on capitalism. Which weakens the overall argument against it, IMO.
Bud, you just agreed with me what the real problems are, yeah monopoly doesnt apply to Roku, but shit product DOES with this change. But all THREE are huge problems for “regulation FREE MARKETS” which is what I listed them in response to
Edit: Formatting
Ah, I think I misunderstood. My mistake. I would make the point that I think many consumers would actually prefer the cheap ad riddled version of many services. Like, many streaming services people complain about having ads, have an ad free tier they’re unwilling to pay for. But I assume you’d make the argument that’s from the poverty created by the other problems within capitalism. Which is a valid criticism.
a job for the free market
Hey, as long as there is a way for ordinary people to attend shareholders meetings in person and have direct physical access to the humans who made these decisions, I’m sure everything will work out in the end.
Is that how you think the free market is supposed to work? People don’t get to decide how companies operate. They have every right to create a shitty product. As long as there’s room for competition to punish them for that bad decision.
Lol, wake up man, the free market hasn’t been free for years now.
Yes the free market always wins!
The best way to prevent ads is to figure out every way in which they can be served in the future, and patenting every one.
And then do nothing with them.
Utility patents expire after 20 years (under US patent law; might have different rules somewhere else).
Twenty years of sweet freedom from ads
Just trademark them and you’ll own them for as long as disney owns mickey
Hopefully this ends up something they never actually do like that sony patent for ads that only go away if you call out the name of the product.
Sony fabitch!
if they patent this, it could be slightly good thing because it might prevent other companies from doing it
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still, others will have to pay for it which might reduce how widely its used.
Sometimes i wonder if it could be worth it to invent shit like this and patent it just so no one else cant do it themselves
Nah, they’ll patent it anyway and then tie you up in BS lawsuits over it. Fighting it will cost you way more than you’re willing to spend, so you’ll settle out of court for a licensing agreement that definitely doesn’t benefit you but makes the lawsuit go away.
